Tay Nishimura from Datadog on How She Built the Confidence to Transition into Infrastructure Engineering
Tay Nishimura describes herself as an artist, philanthropist, and technologist. “When I meet people, they often only know my tech side. I've been trying to change that by presenting all aspects of myself,” she explains.
She achieves this by combining technology with philanthropic work. “I'm the Chief Technology Officer of a non-profit that helps bring technology education into prisons,” she says. “We're in the early phases of developing a curriculum on our learning platform where people can learn about computer networking.”
As for her artistic side, that’s what helps her get into the zone when she’s completely emerged in the tech world. “Painting has been really good for me,” she notes. “I was never trained in that type of visual art, but it comes naturally. I've been doing it a lot to get into a flow state and separate my brain from technology.”
We sat down with Tay to learn how she bridges all sides of her personality into a career as an infrastructure engineer. We also discussed both her career journey and how mentorship and a supportive work environment have helped her succeed.
Entering the Tech World Unexpectedly
Throughout Tay’s childhood, math played an important role.
“Math is a very serious subject in Japan,” she shares. “My mother taught me when I was younger. She gave me a lot of visual frameworks so I had a good foundation.”
Her dedication to math continued to blossom when she went to a math and science summer camp. “There I met my fellow math lovers who I became close with and we grew up together,” she says. “I went to that camp for five years and it set me up to love abstract mathematics.”
Coming from a childhood filled with equations and dividing fractions, studying mathematics in college seemed like an obvious choice. However, Tay’s first interest was in architecture. “I was always building houses as a kid,” she explains. “But when I got older I didn’t make a portfolio to apply to college and so my default was math.”
Once she started taking math courses at her university, she was slowly introduced to the world of computer science and the job opportunities that came with it. “I was always interested in the math side of everything, but when it came time to apply for jobs, everything was programming,” Tay says. “So I took more classes, double majored, and landed in the tech world unexpectedly."
Growing Within and Out of the Computer Science World
Tay began her career as a software engineer and was surprised to learn how flexible the work day can be. “If you need to have a later meeting or work odd hours, as long as you're getting your work done, you can be you,” she highlights.
This new environment has provided her with the space to grow into her own. “It's allowed me to be myself and communicate with people in the way I need to,” she explains.
Over time she started to understand the different communication styles. “You could be the person who's talking to everybody, you could be the person who only messages on Slack,” she says. “People are looking at what you are thinking about and how you present that.”
Tay notes that in other fields, lacking certain soft skills such as public speaking might negatively impact your performance. However, in the computer science world, it tends to be different. “People are trying to understand what you like, what you like to do, and how to find projects that work for you," she explains.
And what Tay really liked to do was in another corner of the engineering world. “I don't think people realize that when they come into the field, there are so many different corners,” she explains. “It’s been fun that every year I'm in a different area of tech.”
Transitioning to Infrastructure Engineering
Infrastructure engineering was the next phase of Tay’s career trajectory, yet she didn’t know if it was the best move. “I was terrified I would not be able to learn enough about networking or virtualization to meet expectations when I started," she admits. “I had always been more on the application side of things.”
When her friends presented her with the idea of switching fields, she wasn’t sure that her experience would provide her with the foundation to make this career change.
“I'm visual and a lot of infrastructure content is not. It's very much paragraphs and I'm a terrible reader,'' she admits. “I didn’t know how computer networking works. I didn’t know how my program runs or where it runs in the cloud. I didn’t know any of that stuff. And when I tried to learn about it, I got lost in the jargon.”
However, all the self-doubt ceased when her friends asked her one crucial question: Have you tried? “That was such an eye-opening question,” she recalls. “You don't know until you try.”
Tay put in the effort, but the road wasn’t easy. “It took me about a year or two before I felt like I understood what infrastructure was,” she confesses.
While studying, she used her artistic side to understand the complex material better. “Because I was reading this jargon that I didn’t understand, I drew everything out for myself and that solidified it in my head,” she explains. “It imprints it in my head, like a blueprint, and I can recall it at any time.”
After putting in the time and effort, her hard work paid off. “Once you build it up, operating Kubernetes and working on a platform engineering team are both really cool. Now I think this is the right place for me, and I never got this excited as an application developer.”
Coming into Her Own as an Infrastructure Engineer
Infrastructure platform engineering focuses on the tools that allow tech companies to deliver their products to customers. “If I were to cook, I would need an oven, a fridge, food, and other tools,'' she explains. “The more well-designed they are, the faster dishes can be produced.”
Part of Tay’s work is providing those tools that help companies do their work. “As an infrastructure engineer, usually what you're building is an enhancement on something already being used by people in your company,” she explains. “Thus, it’s very important to be precise the first time. If a tool breaks, you slow them down — just like if your stove doesn't work, you can't cook anymore.”
This is why Tay spends a good portion of her time designing. “A lot of what we build can't be checked or tested immediately,” she points out. “We need to design all of those situations up front. I would say I spend about 20 to 30% of my time communicating designs.”
A greater part of her time is dedicated to implementation. “I spend another 50 to 60% of my time implementing code or tuning live systems.”
The rest of the time, she solves problems and puts out fires. “Which means we made something, we changed it, it broke and we're fixing it so that other people can continue working,” she explains. “I also spend time talking to people, getting to know what kinds of problems they're solving. Ironically, I feel like a part of my job description is to socialize technical ideas whereas I had the impression that I’d get to socialize less in infrastructure teams than in application teams.”
A Supportive Work Environment at Datadog
When Tay started working at Datadog, she noticed something that set them apart from other start-ups. “Work-life balance is this unicorn word that's thrown around at any booth you go to at a career fair,” Tay says. But at Datadog, these words have meaning.
“I come from a burnout culture. To show to myself and others that I am productive, I’ve spent a lot of hours working,” Tay admits. However, at Datadog they encourage her to do the opposite. “One of the top pieces of feedback that I get is to take more time off.”
Datadog is the SaaS-based monitoring and security platform for cloud-scale infrastructure, applications, logs, and more. They have created a work environment where giving and receiving feedback is part of the company culture.
Tay has received feedback not only on her ability to complete certain projects but also on being more confident. “At first I thought they were messing with me," she recalls. “They weren’t giving me feedback on my unit test [at performance reviews], or the way I communicate information. At Datadog, it's consistently been: be more confident.”
This type of feedback comes from a more constructive style of leadership and guidance. “In our culture, we don't force anything,” Tay explains. “I'm used to the more rigid style of beginning a quarter: here are all the ways you need to improve by the end of the quarter, otherwise you're behind.”
However, Datadog’s structure supports its employees by using additive thinking sometimes known as a snowflake evaluation. “This is where you take the attributes of yourself you enjoy, you sum that up, and that's your evaluation,” Tay explains.
Tay feels that this more additive style of leadership will help her become a senior engineer one day. “As a senior, you have to persuade other people of what you believe in. And a lot of that comes down to confidence,” she says. “This means that confidence becomes part of the job and stops being optional. The way you carry yourself, the way you argue your point, all that matters.”
Advice on Seeking a Mentor and Breaking into the Tech World
Along with having a positive work environment at Datadog, another component of Tay’s success and growth is having mentors. “I've been lucky in finding mentors because I am willing to be vulnerable,” she says. Although she admits that being vulnerable is not easy. “If you walk into a room where they are talking about databases and you say, ‘Hello everyone, I know nothing about databases,’ it does compromise you.”
Fortunately, she had a group of supportive women mentors that guided her when she first entered the field. “They understood when I expressed a problem,” she points out. “I describe experiences as ‘I feel this,’ rather than 'I think this.’ Saying ‘I feel’ is often seen as a weaker assertion, but my mentors perceived my feelings as significant, and always offered time to discuss and address those situations.”
For those looking to advance in other areas of the tech field, Tay offers this advice:
1. Find study partners. “Reading up on your own is a huge part of leveling up as a technologist,” Tay explains. Although extra study time outside of work is needed to get ahead, spending that time alone or not socializing because you’re studying can be difficult. “Find a group of people, whether it be mentors or just friends, that have a similar goal where you need to sit down and work, but also socialize at the same time.”
2. Don’t be discouraged by rejection. “Tech is hard. But getting into tech is its own difficult problem,” Tay admits. While breaking into the world can be hard, she highlights the importance of not giving up. She has seen many people giving up 80% of the way there. “That's so sad because it's just gritting through the last 20% that will get you there. And the thing that helps in those last moments is to realize that you are ready.”
Tay reflects on moments in her career when she struggled to find the role that was right for her. “At that point, I thought I couldn’t do this because if this company rejected me, who would ever take me,” she admits. “However, there's going to be something other than your lack of work experience in tech that makes them say yes. Finding that one company is your goal, and if you apply enough, you will find it. Don't give up.”
3. Build trust with a mentor that is in your desired career. If you have a certain career goal in mind, find someone in that place. “It's worth it to take the extra step, to look for people you want to emulate, and to build a relationship with them. A lot of what mentors have helped me with is telling me I’m supposed to be here and not to give up. But, if you haven’t built up trust with your mentor, then you won't be convinced by those encouraging conversations.” Finally, if you find an incredible person like that, “action their feedback even if you are busy. Nothing makes a mentor want to invest more like seeing their positive impact on your career… that starts with you doing your homework.”
Want to join Datadog’s supportive team? Check out their openings!
Get Ready For the Next Step in Your Career - Prepare For an Interview With Datadog
💎 Going for that next step in your professional career may seem scary. Don’t miss the valuable insight from a recruiter at Datadog about their interview process!
📼 Watch this video to get key advice for the next step in your career. In this video, you’ll meet Adriana Buss, Senior Technical Recruiter at Datadog, who’ll share a walkthrough of the company’s application process and what to expect when applying for a job at Datadog.
👉 Datadog is hiring! Check out the company’s open jobs:
Senior Product Designer (USA remote!) https://bit.ly/DatadogSrProductDesignerPTF
Software Engineer (USA remote!) https://bit.ly/DatadogSoftwareEngineerPTF
Team Lead, Engineering - Compute (Europe remote!) https://bit.ly/DatadogTeamLeadEngineeringPTF
📼 Ready to take the next step in your career by applying for a job at Datadog? Get to know the application process. It starts with the recruiter interview. The purpose is to get to know you better: Who you are, what drives you, and the key elements you are looking for in a role. The company wants to learn more about you and your ideal role.. What does development look like to you? Don’t miss Adriana’s single most crucial piece of advice for the recruiter interview. “Be as honest as possible with us. Open up to us, and just know that we are your advocates. We are here to help you. We are here to support you throughout the process,” says Adriana. The better the Datadog team gets to know you, the easier it will be for them to find you the right position.
📼 When aiming for that next step in your career, it’s essential that you research the company you’re applying to before starting the interview process. For Datadog, you can go from visiting the company website to exploring the product o watching case study videos (either on their website or on YouTube). Watch some demos, and maybe go on some engineering blogs and read what people say about the company. What is it they like? What is it t they don't like about the product? Form an opinion about Datadog, about the product or the platform.
Ready For the Next Step in Your Career: Show Up As Yourself
Bring your true self to these interviews. At Datadog, they want to see the real you; they want to see who you are.. They want to see your strengths, but also your flaws because all these things are what make you great!
🧑💼 Are you interested in joining Datadog? They have open positions! To learn more, click here: https://bit.ly/Datadog_PTF
Get To Know Adriana
Adriana is experienced in leading complex talent projects and applying search techniques across a global remit. Tech-savvy with an in-depth understanding and appreciation of wider HR and resourcing issues and strategy, she specializes in recruiting Product, Leadership, Engineering, and various corporate functions such as Marketing, Content, Finance, and Legal. Currently, she’s looking for great PMs who have a passion for product craftsmanship - to make a product with care, skill, and ingenuity. If you are interested in a career at Datadog, you can connect with her on LinkedIn!
More About Datadog
Datadog is the SaaS-based monitoring and security platform for cloud-scale infrastructure, applications, logs, and more. Datadog delivers complete visibility into the performance of modern applications in one place through its fully unified platform—which improves cross-team collaboration, accelerates development cycles, and reduces operational and development costs.
0:00 Trust in Yourself
0:28 Introducing Datadog
0:36 You Write It, You Run It, You Own It
0:56 Stage 1: Recruiter Interview
1:46 Stage 2: Assessing Your Skills
2:37 The Coding Interview
3:06 Final Stage: What’s On Your Mind?
3:39 Apply Now!
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From IC to Sales Director
Datadog's Lucy Williams-Jones' Unconventional Path through Enterprise Sales and Why She Wants You to Join Her Team
Like many of us, Lucy Williams-Jones' life has been deeply impacted by COVID-19.
Unlike many of us, that impact took the form of a four-day period of time where Lucy was so sick with COVID that she was sure she'd never recover—and a permanent career change when she somehow did.
Now healthy and resettled into a completely new role, the Regional Sales Director for cloud application monitoring platform Datadog chatted with PowerToFly from her home office in England's Cotswolds—"Where Cameron Diaz and Kate Winslet were in The Holiday," offers Lucy, gesturing to the idyllic countryside outside her window—to share more of her story.
The individual contributor comfort zone
When Lucy got started in sales, she was 18 and figured she'd be in the field for the length of her gap year. She then planned to go to university and pursue her goal of becoming a sports therapist for a rugby team.
"Then I found out in that first year that I could make a lot of money!" says Lucy, who ended up staying at that company, Quest, for over a decade.
During that time, Lucy was almost always an individual contributor. She liked the feeling of being in charge of her own destiny, and in pushing herself to consistently beat her goals and keep pushing for more and more success. "I was really happy smashing my number every quarter and enjoying the kind of benefits that come from that from a monetary standpoint," she explains.
Ten years in, she did transition into a leadership role and found some success there—but two things got in her way.
First, her lack of experience. "I didn't have all the tools necessary to equip my team members with," she says. "That's why I did everything rather than teach other people. I'd basically just take on their workload and change everything so that it was fit to go out."
And second, her lack of desire to keep living in Cork, Ireland.
"I wanted to come back to London and the only way to do that and earn a lot of money, which is what drives me, was to go back to an IC role," explains Lucy. She did that, and worked at a few different companies before Datadog reached out and she took an enterprise sales role with them.
"The struggle I've had with other technologies previously is that you can't demonstrate them real-time," says Lucy. "If you have an awesome platform like we have [at Datadog], when you show it to someone, you can see their eyes light up, they can see the value right away."
She was excited by the product, by the market opportunity—"it's a product everyone needs, especially as they migrate from on-prem into the cloud," she says—and by the real-life implications for clients. "When I get an Uber and the app doesn't work, I know that if they've got our software, they're going to figure out exactly where it is and it's going to mend soon, so I'm not going to get my hair wet whilst waiting for a cab—English weather, you know—while I'm waiting for the app to reboot!" she says.
Taking advantage of her second chance
When Lucy got sick with COVID in early 2021, she immediately knew it was serious. Her blood oxygen was down at 82%—the NYC health department suggests immediately going to the hospital for an oxygen level of less than 90%—but she wanted to stick it out at home. "I decided not to go to hospital because I didn't want to not come out," she says.
Lucy says that she was lying in bed, wondering what her legacy would be if she died the next day, when it hit her: she wanted a chance to pass on all she'd learned from her 22 years in enterprise sales to the next generation.
"I've learned a lot of skills that have enabled me to be successful, to have the cash to buy a forever home, go on nice holidays, explore, and travel. And when I was lying there, I realized, 'I really want to transfer these skills to young women in tech, because I think that we're an underrepresented group, and I could actually get those young women living their best lives and earning the cash that they deserve," she says.
So she reached out to her manager and told him she was ready for a leadership position. He'd been asking her to consider taking on a leadership role for a while. It wasn't until she hit her annual number at the end of the first quarter, right after recovering from COVID, and told him she was still serious about leaving behind the responsibilities she knew so well for the more complicated and less immediately gratifying world of management that he knew she was serious.
Now, three months into that transition, Lucy is sure she made the right move. "So many people have been touched by COVID this year in negative ways," she says. "For me, I feel I'm super lucky every morning when I wake up; I've taken a positive from it."
"There's been lots of learnings, but I know this is the right career choice right now. I know Datadog will support me and that I'll earn my stripes as a true enterprise leader," she says. "My focus is on passing the knowledge that I've got to other people."
To do that, Lucy has to first shore up her own knowledge. She spent her first month on the job looking closely at the business and her team and implementing changes to help everything run better, and the second month focused on measuring the impact of those changes. Additionally, she's had to get comfortable giving up control of her own accounts—"my little family," as she calls them—and managing outcomes through others.
To help her on this journey, Lucy is also brushing up on sales leadership techniques with a few favorite books, including:
- MEDDICC: The ultimate guide to staying one step ahead in the complex sale by Andy Whyte
- The Qualified Sales Leader: Proven Lessons from a Five Time CRO by John McMahon
- The Power of Habit: Why We Do What We Do in Life and Business by Charles Duhigg
- Thanks for the Feedback: The Science and Art of Receiving Feedback Well by Douglas Stone and Sheila Heen
3 ways she's building a positive culture
As an enterprise sales leader, Lucy has both the power and the responsibility to create a positive environment for her growing team. To do that, she's focusing on:
- Being thoughtful about why she's engaging. Lucy doesn't respond to emails immediately anymore. Instead, she thoughtfully considers a three-part framework before crafting her response: "I'm analyzing, reviewing, and then offering advice."
- Not saying "I need." Communication from Lucy to her team has absolutely no unnecessary urgency, she says, which is why she expressly doesn't use the word "need." "I try to make it really about, 'This is the reason why I'm asking for it, this is the benefit it's going to bring, let's work together to get something that's going to be amazing,'" she says.
- Mentoring ICs. When a SDR in Datadog's Dublin office reached out to Lucy for career advice, Lucy jumped on the chance to help her. "She's at that roundabout of, 'Do I want to go into leadership? Do I want to be an enterprise seller?' Coaching her to be the best she can be has been really, really lovely...she's successful now, but she could be exceptional."
The 3 things she's hiring for
Lucy is doubling her team size and is looking for the next generation of sales leaders to bring onboard. If that sounds like you, make sure you've got these three traits she's looking for:
- Coachability. "That's the number-one trait I look for in someone," explains Lucy. "It's the ability to take on advice and feedback and adapt. It's not saying that my way is always the right way, but it's making sure that you understand that there are different approaches. [One] of the toughest but most important parts of life is receiving feedback."
- High EQ. Lucy is looking for people who are self-aware. "You need to understand how people are perceiving you, to understand what kinds of playbooks work for you."
- Affinity for pipeline generation. "You've got to do cold outreach to new logos, but you've also got to do it in a creative manner. I've seen people doing videos and stuff, which I think is really cool; you've got to stick with the cadence and actually do it. If you don't like PG, enterprise sales at Datadog may not be the job for you," says Lucy.
Lucy has a simple motto that she has internalized throughout her career thanks to her first MD, Simon Perce: "Leave no stone unturned."
If you'd like to give 100% in pursuit of your goals alongside Lucy, check out Datadog's open roles! "I would love to build a team of strong, capable, amazing, female enterprise sales execs," says Lucy.
[VIDEO 🎥 ] Tips on Selling During a Pandemic
Watch time: 3:40
Naomi Italiaander, Enterprise Account Executive at Datadog, gave us some insider tips on selling in challenging times and markets.
You'll hear surprising insight into how Naomi's background in investigative journalism helps her to understand customers' needs and the nuances of her market.
To learn more about Datadog and their open roles, click here.
